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Pedophilia is a natural sexual orientation

filbs111

Outlander
Messages
4
The thing about natural vs unnatural sexuality is simplistic and often bullshit IMO. People say it because it has political capital. The whole innate/choice thing is used similarly.

IMO sexuality is part nature, part nurture, and once developed, is somewhat malleable.

This doesn't mean that people shouldn't be gay, or into clowns, or whatever.

Similarly with the trans thing. People say they were "born in the wrong body", but this makes no real sense. It's politically useful to say this though. That's not to say people shouldn't dress up like a sexy lady, or go to the doctor and get their bits chopped and changed, if they fancy it.
 

Houseman

The Actual Hero
Sanctuary legend
Messages
766
The doublethink here is strong. Either sexuality is a choice so pedophiles are just monsters, and gay people are just doing it wrong for the lulz, or sexuality is nature, and there is nothing that can be done besides repress those desires. However, getting "help" will be pointless because it's in their nature.

I do agree compassion is necessary, but if your natural state is that toxic, then what choice do we have than to maintain the status quo? Protection of our kids is protection of our future, and one loose pedo is enough to destroy many kids.
Thinking about this again (and bumping it to the front page, heh), I wanted to echo Signa's concern. The "lgbt" movement really shot itself in the foot and put itself in an untenable position here. You can't have "This is the way I was born, this can't be changed, deal with it!" in reference to homosexuality, and also "nooo, you can't be born that way" in reference to pedophilia.

The same logic that you use for homosexuality, also applies here. There's no difference. You can either have both, or neither.
People saw this coming, and tried to warn them, but they persisted anyway.

However, just because something is "natural" doesn't mean it has to be acted on or even tolerated. But, by that same reasoning, a society could also refuse to tolerate lgbt.

Also, I found and listened to a very similar talk on the same subject:

 

Gauche

Disciple
Messages
438
A 13,000 year old skeleton of a sixteen year old mom was found in Mexico a bit ago.
They say that the notches in her teeth indicate she was a responsible mother that did just fine.

Have a quote:
A fragment of a speech by Lysias offers more evidence of
Alcibiades’ immorality: he and Axiochos shared a woman in
Abydos and did not know which of them was the father of her
daughter, so when the girl became nubile they took turns to sleep
with her, each claiming that she was the child of his friend.
People use/abuse others
Hard numbers set in law regarding consent age are dumb but it isn't like most folk have a special prepubescent in their life they're just dying to marry.
 

Epyc Wynn

Adherent
Messages
41
The universal age should be 16, and the federal age-gap of tolerance for those under that age dating someone above their age should be anyone within 5 years of said person's age.

Hard numbers are necessary for understanding. If you need tolerance that transcends numbers, you don't need a new law, you need a good culture that breeds juries willing to listen to context and be tolerant.

The age being an absolute 18 is really fucking stupid and was pulled out of some politician's ass and is over-enforced by cowards who try to hide their own feelings online by aggressively insisting that the "age of consent MUST be 18" as if to imply God said so, is bollocks.

I wouldn't legally want the law of a land to go below 16 outside of the aforementioned case of a within-5-years-age-gap though.
 

Drathnoxis

Adherent
Messages
93
Thinking about this again (and bumping it to the front page, heh), I wanted to echo Signa's concern. The "lgbt" movement really shot itself in the foot and put itself in an untenable position here. You can't have "This is the way I was born, this can't be changed, deal with it!" in reference to homosexuality, and also "nooo, you can't be born that way" in reference to pedophilia.

The same logic that you use for homosexuality, also applies here. There's no difference. You can either have both, or neither.
People saw this coming, and tried to warn them, but they persisted anyway.
Our world and logic only have a passing relationship, whoever told you otherwise is a liar. You can have it both ways, because shut up you dirty homophobic pedo! Emotions will win over logic every time so why even bother?

I wouldn't legally want the law of a land to go below 16 outside of the aforementioned case of a within-5-years-age-gap though.
Within 5 years is pretty sketch with a 16 year old screwing an 11 year old, though. Probably several age brackets would work better.
 

Arnox

Veteran
Staff member
Founder
Messages
4,335
Emotions will win over logic every time so why even bother?
For the same reason you clean your dishes every time after a meal. They're just going to get dirty again, so why bother? Because some things need to be continually supported and maintained or else our quality of living tends to take a dive.
 

Houseman

The Actual Hero
Sanctuary legend
Messages
766
Also related to this, incels, and using "incel" as an insult.

Every time you call someone an incel, you put sex up on a pedestal and imply that the person is less valued as an individual for not having had it yet.
You're reinforcing, to everyone who hears you, "if you're a virgin, you should feel bad. You're worth less".

And you know what? Those people probably do feel bad, and then voila! You've created another incel.

Every time you use "incel" as an insult, you create another incel. Want fewer incels? Stop insulting people on the basis of virginity.

This is related to pedophilia in the sense that we don't know how to deal with it in a healthy way, we just use the word as an insult and imply that people should be shunned and driven out of society. Imagine if the word wasn't an insult. Imagine if it was just like "paraplegic" or "asthmatic". Then people would seek help, instead of being driven underground.
 

Arnox

Veteran
Staff member
Founder
Messages
4,335
Also related to this, incels, and using "incel" as an insult.

Every time you call someone an incel, you put sex up on a pedestal and imply that the person is less valued as an individual for not having had it yet.
You're reinforcing, to everyone who hears you, "if you're a virgin, you should feel bad. You're worth less".

And you know what? Those people probably do feel bad, and then voila! You've created another incel.

Every time you use "incel" as an insult, you create another incel. Want fewer incels? Stop insulting people on the basis of virginity.

This is related to pedophilia in the sense that we don't know how to deal with it in a healthy way, we just use the word as an insult and imply that people should be shunned and driven out of society. Imagine if the word wasn't an insult. Imagine if it was just like "paraplegic" or "asthmatic". Then people would seek help, instead of being driven underground.
Nah, I don't agree there, Houseman. Pedophile/Pedophilia are the exact terms for these things, even if they're used to shun people. Incel though is harder to argue with because even though it's also a technically correct term, it gets very often thrown around willy nilly without any basis.
 

Houseman

The Actual Hero
Sanctuary legend
Messages
766
Pedophile/Pedophilia are the exact terms for these things, even if they're used to shun people.
Whether or not its the "exact term" is irrelevant. If it's used as an insult, and it's implied that these people are to be shunned and/or destroyed, that's the issue. Plus, many times, it's NOT the "exact term". Many times, ephebophile or hebophile would work better, depending on the circumstances.

The term being "correct" or "exact" is not the issue.
 

Arnox

Veteran
Staff member
Founder
Messages
4,335
Whether or not its the "exact term" is irrelevant. If it's used as an insult, and it's implied that these people are to be shunned and/or destroyed, that's the issue. Plus, many times, it's NOT the "exact term". Many times, ephebophile or hebophile would work better, depending on the circumstances.

The term being "correct" or "exact" is not the issue.
I'm saying I don't think we should stop using the correct terms just because they have a negative connotation.
 

Vendor-Lazarus

Arch Disciple
Sanctuary legend
Messages
647
See, the problem is that Incel means Involuntarily Celibate. By that definition, I'm an Incel. But that's not how the label is used or portrayed. It gets even muddier separating incel and volcel. BTW, Houseman is correct about Pedophilia (0-10) vs Hebephilia (11-14) vs Ephebophilia (15-19).
 
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