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Pedophilia is a natural sexual orientation

Houseman

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"Pedophilia is a natural sexual orientation" is the title of a TEDx talk by Mirjam Heine of the University of Würzburg


The funny thing is that TED unknowingly posted this video on their main page/site, and then once they realized the controversial material they had on their hands, they quickly threw it under the bus and tried to censor it from the internet, abusing the copyright system and DMCA laws in order to do so. This video itself probably won't last long. I guess this isn't considered an "idea worth spreading"[nb]TED's motto[/nb]

TED has not released an official statement yet.

In case that it vanishes, I have a copy that I can upload.

Censorship aside, the tl;dr of the talk is: "Stop stigmatizing pedophiles, it only drives them underground and causes them to molest children. If you stop, they can get the help they need to control their urges and not do anything illegal"

I agree somewhat, but I'm more of the opinion that anything about your sexuality can be changed if you are motivated enough to change it.

I think it's good discussion fodder and a funny example of internet censorship.
 
Last edited:

Kaleion

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While I can see the controversy about what she's saying I must say that her argument is very reasonable, as it stands we pretty much ask all pedophiles to basically kill themselves, and I get it right, sexual abuse is an awful thing and I know it can have devastating effects on a child's psychology, but she's right by helping treat pedophiles you're not endorsing that behaviour and you do a lot more to help prevent a tragedy in the future.

In any case, her argument is sound, but I can't see many people being willing to listen to it and taking it seriously, especially considering that even the platform that was used to deliver it is censoring the message, I'd consider that a shame because that really does make sense.
 

Arnox

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Re: Censored TED Talk: Pedophilia is a natural sexual orientation

I think her point is very valid. It's a super tough topic to talk about though due to all the atrocities committed as OP mentioned. I more than understand the hate people have for it, but if we REALLY want to fix this, then we will have to gather ourselves together and take some steps to stop vilifying who they are merely because of how they feel and start actually treating them.
 

Vendor-Lazarus

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Re: Censored TED Talk: Pedophilia is a natural sexual orientation

She talks a lot of sense. Though that's coming from someone who is attracted to a certain body type which can be defined as slim/muscular, tomboy, ephebophilia, hebephilia and very close to pedophilia.
I can certainly see the aesthetic beauty in the female form of younger people.
That doesn't mean I would ever act sexually towards non-pubescent children, and I most absolutely abhor any type of sexual abuse, not matter the age or gender.
I also don't feel that same instinctual revulsion and angry feeling that most everyone else is afflicted by.

I don't think these kinds of talks or support is going to help one iota. Not unless it starts with people learning to separate and distance themselves from their feelings to be able to think logically about something.
Reading the comments for that video is enough to settle that matter.
I can understand that to protect innocents in general and a parental instinct is rather hardwired, but so is a lot of things we've overcome, like rape.

*EDIT*
I knew there was something I had forgotten.

As long as the treatment is voluntary, or enforced after a criminal act, that I think that people seeking such help is a good thing. Especially those that feel close to acting out.
In my country, 15 is the age which people are allowed to consent to sex, and I think that's entirely reasonable.
The cultural influence and censorship of the USA has had deleterious effects on viewing anyone under 18 as experimenting or their own agent as anything other than wrong.
In every other case of animal, a sexual maturation means just that. That they are ready for sexual acts.
A human society is a bit different, granted, but there shouldn't be a hard limit age but instead based upon consent and abuse.
 

bluegate

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Re: Censored TED Talk: Pedophilia is a natural sexual orientation

Vendor-Lazarus said:
I knew there was something I had forgotten.

As long as the treatment is voluntary, or enforced after a criminal act, that I think that people seeking such help is a good thing. Especially those that feel close to acting out.
In my country, 15 is the age which people are allowed to consent to sex, and I think that's entirely reasonable.
The cultural influence and censorship of the USA has had deleterious effects on viewing anyone under 18 as experimenting or their own agent as anything other than wrong.
In every other case of animal, a sexual maturation means just that. That they are ready for sexual acts.
A human society is a bit different, granted, but there shouldn't be a hard limit age but instead based upon consent and abuse.
Know what else it should be based on? The level of maturity of the people involved and whether they are mature enough to understand and deal with the consequences of their actions.

A 15 year old kid is, in general, not old enough to carry the burdens of having a family so they really shouldn't be involved in acts that could result in them having families. Obviously it's hard to keep teenagers from experimenting, but that's where sexual education needs to come in to teach kids about the consequences and responsibilities that come with having sex and, if they really want to do it, how to do it relatively safely.
 

Signa

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The doublethink here is strong. Either sexuality is a choice so pedophiles are just monsters, and gay people are just doing it wrong for the lulz, or sexuality is nature, and there is nothing that can be done besides repress those desires. However, getting "help" will be pointless because it's in their nature.

I do agree compassion is necessary, but if your natural state is that toxic, then what choice do we have than to maintain the status quo? Protection of our kids is protection of our future, and one loose pedo is enough to destroy many kids.
 

infinityshock

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331
Arnox said:
Title has been slightly altered for context. Please don't change it, Houseman. lol
you stupid fuck...youre still fucking shit up.

after you utterly and thoroughly fucked the first iteration of this shit-site in the ass you didnt learn your lesson and are right back at it.

when someone makes a post or a thread theyre doing so at their own direction from their own creation and dont need or want you fucking it up into your own twisted version of fantasy.

you literally need to remove 'freedom of speech *penis* freedom of information' from the top banner of this site because you are absolutely and painfully clueless on what those terms mean and have no ability to comply with the basic premise of those sayings.
 

Signa

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infinityshock said:
Arnox said:
Title has been slightly altered for context. Please don't change it, Houseman. lol
you stupid fuck...youre still fucking shit up.

after you utterly and thoroughly fucked the first iteration of this shit-site in the ass you didnt learn your lesson and are right back at it.

when someone makes a post or a thread theyre doing so at their own direction from their own creation and dont need or want you fucking it up into your own twisted version of fantasy.

you literally need to remove 'freedom of speech *penis* freedom of information' from the top banner of this site because you are absolutely and painfully clueless on what those terms mean and have no ability to comply with the basic premise of those sayings.
No, the title is more precise this way. The original title had me thinking it was one of your threads. Now it's clear it's really about a Ted talk.
 

infinityshock

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331
Signa said:
infinityshock said:
you stupid fuck...youre still fucking shit up.

after you utterly and thoroughly fucked the first iteration of this shit-site in the ass you didnt learn your lesson and are right back at it.

when someone makes a post or a thread theyre doing so at their own direction from their own creation and dont need or want you fucking it up into your own twisted version of fantasy.

you literally need to remove 'freedom of speech *penis* freedom of information' from the top banner of this site because you are absolutely and painfully clueless on what those terms mean and have no ability to comply with the basic premise of those sayings.
No, the title is more precise this way. The original title had me thinking it was one of your threads. Now it's clear it's really about a Ted talk.
stfu arnie. now youre just spamming.
 

Houseman

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Re: Censored TED Talk: Pedophilia is a natural sexual orientation

I deliberately chose to title my thread the way that I did. I agree with infinity, this was my choice, my freedom of expression, and it's been removed.


I don't like it.
 

Arnox

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Re: Censored TED Talk: Pedophilia is a natural sexual orientation

Houseman said:
I deliberately chose to title my thread the way that I did. I agree with infinity, this was my choice, my freedom of expression, and it's been removed.

I don't like it.
Fine. But let me ask you this one thing. When new visitors come to the site and one of the first threads in the recent topics is "Pedophilia is a natural sexual orientation", what exactly do you think is going to be their reaction?

Still want me to change it back?
 

Vendor-Lazarus

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Re: Censored TED Talk: Pedophilia is a natural sexual orientation

bluegate said:
Vendor-Lazarus said:
I knew there was something I had forgotten.

As long as the treatment is voluntary, or enforced after a criminal act, that I think that people seeking such help is a good thing. Especially those that feel close to acting out.
In my country, 15 is the age which people are allowed to consent to sex, and I think that's entirely reasonable.
The cultural influence and censorship of the USA has had deleterious effects on viewing anyone under 18 as experimenting or their own agent as anything other than wrong.
In every other case of animal, a sexual maturation means just that. That they are ready for sexual acts.
A human society is a bit different, granted, but there shouldn't be a hard limit age but instead based upon consent and abuse.
Know what else it should be based on? The level of maturity of the people involved and whether they are mature enough to understand and deal with the consequences of their actions.

A 15 year old kid is, in general, not old enough to carry the burdens of having a family so they really shouldn't be involved in acts that could result in them having families. Obviously it's hard to keep teenagers from experimenting, but that's where sexual education needs to come in to teach kids about the consequences and responsibilities that come with having sex and, if they really want to do it, how to do it relatively safely.
If we are going to need to define maturity, then 18 wont be enough. Hell, 80 wouldn't even be enough for some.
Many people have problems with thinking long-term and what their actions can have in terms of consequences.
Who is going to judge them and by what criteria?

A 15 year old young adult is old enough to be taught how to behave in a civilized society. Why not the sexual acts they are ready for physically as well as hormonally?
I'm all for teaching about contraception. Informed consent is good. The more information, the better.
 

Houseman

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Re: Censored TED Talk: Pedophilia is a natural sexual orientation

What their reaction will be is exactly what I aim to achieve. I considered this and mindfully chose my title.


Please have a little faith in me and trust me to be aware of my communications, and how they will be received.


Please change it back, thanks.
 

Arnox

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Re: Censored TED Talk: Pedophilia is a natural sexual orientation

Houseman said:
What their reaction will be is exactly what I aim to achieve.
Closing the tab as fast as they possibly can, you mean.

I changed it back but I really don't agree with that title at all.
 

Signa

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Re: Censored TED Talk: Pedophilia is a natural sexual orientation

Vendor-Lazarus said:
bluegate said:
Know what else it should be based on? The level of maturity of the people involved and whether they are mature enough to understand and deal with the consequences of their actions.

A 15 year old kid is, in general, not old enough to carry the burdens of having a family so they really shouldn't be involved in acts that could result in them having families. Obviously it's hard to keep teenagers from experimenting, but that's where sexual education needs to come in to teach kids about the consequences and responsibilities that come with having sex and, if they really want to do it, how to do it relatively safely.
If we are going to need to define maturity, then 18 wont be enough. Hell, 80 wouldn't even be enough for some.
Many people have problems with thinking long-term and what their actions can have in terms of consequences.
Who is going to judge them and by what criteria?

A 15 year old young adult is old enough to be taught how to behave in a civilized society. Why not the sexual acts they are ready for physically as well as hormonally?
I'm all for teaching about contraception. Informed consent is good. The more information, the better.
Imo, 16 is probably the best age if we have to set a hard, generalized number. We've decided that it's OK to place the responsibility of driving on 16 year olds, and a reckless driver can end lives. By that extent, shouldn't we trust them with the responsibility of making lives at the same age?
 

Vendor-Lazarus

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Re: Censored TED Talk: Pedophilia is a natural sexual orientation

Signa said:
Vendor-Lazarus said:
If we are going to need to define maturity, then 18 wont be enough. Hell, 80 wouldn't even be enough for some.
Many people have problems with thinking long-term and what their actions can have in terms of consequences.
Who is going to judge them and by what criteria?

A 15 year old young adult is old enough to be taught how to behave in a civilized society. Why not the sexual acts they are ready for physically as well as hormonally?
I'm all for teaching about contraception. Informed consent is good. The more information, the better.
Imo, 16 is probably the best age if we have to set a hard, generalized number. We've decided that it's OK to place the responsibility of driving on 16 year olds, and a reckless driver can end lives. By that extent, shouldn't we trust them with the responsibility of making lives at the same age?
16 for driving (alone) is in America (and maybe some other places). ,)
Here it's 18. 16 if you're accompanied by an adult with "driving teacher" papers.
Hunting license (and rifle) is 15 under adult supervision and 18 alone.
Moped is 15 here. Drinking in bars varies from 18-21, often it's women 18 and men 21, but as I said it varies.
Purchasing alcohol and tobacco is 18. Marrying is 18. Army is 18, I think.
Though these things used to have no age restriction or a younger one. I "blame" American influences. ^^

Setting a hard number is difficult as it is, but I could agree with 16.
 

Monoochrom

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Depends. I'm no expert, is it a orientation? I've heard some people argue that it is actually a fetish, which I suppose could be seen in a rather different light.

I'll put it this way, I can see why someone might want to fuck a 15 yr old. A 15 year old can look pretty mature and hot. How someone of sound mind could however go through with it without being disgusted with themselves is beyond me. Why? Because 15 year olds, no matter how good they are at feigning a mature mindset, are KIDS. They can't reasonibly understand the consequences of such actions. Even Sex Ed isn't going to help, that doesn't teach how to manage relationships.

Even if you were the biggest loser of a adult, it would be easy to use the perks of adulthood to manipulate some poor young kid. And that on the other hand is enough to take a meaningful hand in shaping their life for the foreseeable future.

For that reason I am perfectly fine with systems that keep minors and adults seperate, with certain exceptions for situations in which one of the partners in a pre-established relationship has aged out of their bracket.

Edit: For Context, I am not commenting on the Video itself, I haven't seen it as it is currently unavailible.
 

bluegate

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Vendor-Lazarus said:
bluegate said:
Know what else it should be based on? The level of maturity of the people involved and whether they are mature enough to understand and deal with the consequences of their actions.

A 15 year old kid is, in general, not old enough to carry the burdens of having a family so they really shouldn't be involved in acts that could result in them having families. Obviously it's hard to keep teenagers from experimenting, but that's where sexual education needs to come in to teach kids about the consequences and responsibilities that come with having sex and, if they really want to do it, how to do it relatively safely.
If we are going to need to define maturity, then 18 wont be enough. Hell, 80 wouldn't even be enough for some.
Many people have problems with thinking long-term and what their actions can have in terms of consequences.
Who is going to judge them and by what criteria?

A 15 year old young adult is old enough to be taught how to behave in a civilized society. Why not the sexual acts they are ready for physically as well as hormonally?
I'm all for teaching about contraception. Informed consent is good. The more information, the better.
Just because there are immature adults doesn't mean that we shouldn't try to draw a line for maturity in general.

Is a 15 year old kid old enough to hold a job that is able to support him/her and a child? I doubt it. Is a 15 year old kid mature enough to realize that the next 15-20+ years of his/her life will be devoted to a kid of their own? Most likely not. 15 year olds aren't even done with their basic education yet, they really have no business being sexually active and risking getting a child themselves.

That's not even mentioning how impressionable and manipulable children still are at that age, not just by their peers but especially by adults.
 

Vendor-Lazarus

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bluegate said:
Vendor-Lazarus said:
If we are going to need to define maturity, then 18 wont be enough. Hell, 80 wouldn't even be enough for some.
Many people have problems with thinking long-term and what their actions can have in terms of consequences.
Who is going to judge them and by what criteria?

A 15 year old young adult is old enough to be taught how to behave in a civilized society. Why not the sexual acts they are ready for physically as well as hormonally?
I'm all for teaching about contraception. Informed consent is good. The more information, the better.
Just because there are immature adults doesn't mean that we shouldn't try to draw a line for maturity in general.

Is a 15 year old kid old enough to hold a job that is able to support him/her and a child? I doubt it. Is a 15 year old kid mature enough to realize that the next 15-20+ years of his/her life will be devoted to a kid of their own? Most likely not. 15 year olds aren't even done with their basic education yet, they really have no business being sexually active and risking getting a child themselves.

That's not even mentioning how impressionable and manipulable children still are at that age, not just by their peers but especially by adults.
15 year olds were mature enough to work jobs since jobs first arose, until about a 100 years ago.
No one can really be prepared for what having a child entails in terms of changes to their life, but just having sex doesn't imply having a child.
Education? 25 year olds aren't really "done" with their education.
In fact, implementation and changes to child job laws have a correlation to our increased time in schools.
Adults can still be impressionable and manipulated.
 

Kaleion

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Vendor-Lazarus said:
bluegate said:
Just because there are immature adults doesn't mean that we shouldn't try to draw a line for maturity in general.

Is a 15 year old kid old enough to hold a job that is able to support him/her and a child? I doubt it. Is a 15 year old kid mature enough to realize that the next 15-20+ years of his/her life will be devoted to a kid of their own? Most likely not. 15 year olds aren't even done with their basic education yet, they really have no business being sexually active and risking getting a child themselves.

That's not even mentioning how impressionable and manipulable children still are at that age, not just by their peers but especially by adults.
15 year olds were mature enough to work jobs since jobs first arose, until about a 100 years ago.
No one can really be prepared for what having a child entails in terms of changes to their life, but just having sex doesn't imply having a child.
Education? 25 year olds aren't really "done" with their education.
In fact, implementation and changes to child job laws have a correlation to our increased time in schools.
Adults can still be impressionable and manipulated.
And we should be grateful that 15 year olds are now considered too young for that and are allowed a bit more time to mature, I mean come on I didn't know shit about anything when I was 15 but I was convinced I knew everything, not a good attitude to have out there on your own.

And yes adults are impressionable and easy to manipulate too but at the age of 18 onwards at least you actually have a chance to get a job that can actually sustain a family even if you're not propperly educated, and sure 25 year olds are studying too but most people by that age have a better grasp of management than a 15 year old.

Plus a 15 year old parent is very likely to just be a burden to their own parents, anyway I personally think 15 is way too young, I think the age of consent should be when you are legally considered an adult and get a reasonably paying job which would be roughly at 18 in most countries, but what the fuck do I know in my country 13 is the age of consent in some states.
 

Vendor-Lazarus

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Kaleion said:
Vendor-Lazarus said:
15 year olds were mature enough to work jobs since jobs first arose, until about a 100 years ago.
No one can really be prepared for what having a child entails in terms of changes to their life, but just having sex doesn't imply having a child.
Education? 25 year olds aren't really "done" with their education.
In fact, implementation and changes to child job laws have a correlation to our increased time in schools.
Adults can still be impressionable and manipulated.
And we should be grateful that 15 year olds are now considered too young for that and are allowed a bit more time to mature, I mean come on I didn't know shit about anything when I was 15 but I was convinced I knew everything, not a good attitude to have out there on your own.

And yes adults are impressionable and easy to manipulate too but at the age of 18 onwards at least you actually have a chance to get a job that can actually sustain a family even if you're not propperly educated, and sure 25 year olds are studying too but most people by that age have a better grasp of management than a 15 year old.

Plus a 15 year old parent is very likely to just be a burden to their own parents, anyway I personally think 15 is way too young, I think the age of consent should be when you are legally considered an adult and get a reasonably paying job which would be roughly at 18 in most countries, but what the fuck do I know in my country 13 is the age of consent in some states.
Both you and Bluegate seems to constantly bring up family and child.. I take you are from Christian abstinence countries?

Anyway, let me reiterate. Having sex doesn't not imply having a child.
They can and are entirely entirely separate instances, thanks to modern contraception.
 

Kaleion

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Vendor-Lazarus said:
Kaleion said:
And we should be grateful that 15 year olds are now considered too young for that and are allowed a bit more time to mature, I mean come on I didn't know shit about anything when I was 15 but I was convinced I knew everything, not a good attitude to have out there on your own.

And yes adults are impressionable and easy to manipulate too but at the age of 18 onwards at least you actually have a chance to get a job that can actually sustain a family even if you're not propperly educated, and sure 25 year olds are studying too but most people by that age have a better grasp of management than a 15 year old.

Plus a 15 year old parent is very likely to just be a burden to their own parents, anyway I personally think 15 is way too young, I think the age of consent should be when you are legally considered an adult and get a reasonably paying job which would be roughly at 18 in most countries, but what the fuck do I know in my country 13 is the age of consent in some states.
Both you and Bluegate seems to constantly bring up family and child.. I take you are from Christian abstinence countries?

Anyway, let me reiterate. Having sex doesn't not imply having a child.
They can and are entirely entirely separate instances, thanks to modern contraception.
Indeed and that's great, and it's inevitable that teens will fornicate with each other and that's fine, that's what modern contraception is for, but I don't think adults should be messing around with kids increasing the chances of pregnancy, because regardless of any modern contraception there is still always the chance of pregnancy and that's what's important.

Plus I do find it really disgusting to think of a twenty something fooling around with some kid that is still in high school having dumb problems such as having a girl talking behind their back or being bullied by some jock, it's just common sense.

And yes, I was brought up in a Christian environment but I'm not religious, I just think that teens are easier to manipulate than most adults and most are not financially able to cope with the very possible scenario of pregnancy.

And yes a lot of my feelings on the matter come from the fact that I was very emotionally unstable when I was that age and someone did take advantage of that and it felt fucking awful, most kids that age aren't mature enough to deal with those issues but at least they're more understandable when kept between kids rather than between a kid and a creepy older guy that just has a fetish for young kids or is a pedophile or I guess hebephilliac in this case but whatever, my point is that while some kids may be able to deal with that stuff most aren't mature enough at those ages, and while 18 is still a bit iffy most people have a lot more maturity by that age.
 

Monoochrom

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Vendor-Lazarus said:
Kaleion said:
And we should be grateful that 15 year olds are now considered too young for that and are allowed a bit more time to mature, I mean come on I didn't know shit about anything when I was 15 but I was convinced I knew everything, not a good attitude to have out there on your own.

And yes adults are impressionable and easy to manipulate too but at the age of 18 onwards at least you actually have a chance to get a job that can actually sustain a family even if you're not propperly educated, and sure 25 year olds are studying too but most people by that age have a better grasp of management than a 15 year old.

Plus a 15 year old parent is very likely to just be a burden to their own parents, anyway I personally think 15 is way too young, I think the age of consent should be when you are legally considered an adult and get a reasonably paying job which would be roughly at 18 in most countries, but what the fuck do I know in my country 13 is the age of consent in some states.
Both you and Bluegate seems to constantly bring up family and child.. I take you are from Christian abstinence countries?

Anyway, let me reiterate. Having sex doesn't not imply having a child.
They can and are entirely entirely separate instances, thanks to modern contraception.
Irrelevant.

What has been pointed out to you, multiple times now, is that these are immature children. They do not make thoughtful choices based on a realistic understanding of the parameters of their choice.

The existence of contraceptives has no bearing on whether they are actually used or not. Age and therefore experience however have a massive influence on the quality of a persons decisions and their understanding of the world around them.
 

bluegate

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Vendor-Lazarus said:
Kaleion said:
And we should be grateful that 15 year olds are now considered too young for that and are allowed a bit more time to mature, I mean come on I didn't know shit about anything when I was 15 but I was convinced I knew everything, not a good attitude to have out there on your own.

And yes adults are impressionable and easy to manipulate too but at the age of 18 onwards at least you actually have a chance to get a job that can actually sustain a family even if you're not propperly educated, and sure 25 year olds are studying too but most people by that age have a better grasp of management than a 15 year old.

Plus a 15 year old parent is very likely to just be a burden to their own parents, anyway I personally think 15 is way too young, I think the age of consent should be when you are legally considered an adult and get a reasonably paying job which would be roughly at 18 in most countries, but what the fuck do I know in my country 13 is the age of consent in some states.
Both you and Bluegate seems to constantly bring up family and child.. I take you are from Christian abstinence countries?

Anyway, let me reiterate. Having sex doesn't not imply having a child.
They can and are entirely entirely separate instances, thanks to modern contraception.
I'm not a religious person, I don't think that sex should be solely for procreation or just between two married people, I think that if done right it's a very fun activity and I see little problem with it as a recreational thing, but all parties involved should be responsible about it.

As for why I bring up having kids and a family, getting pregnant / impregnating a person is a very realistic consequence of having sex, even if as an accident. And in case of such an accident I would rather that the parties involved are capable of carrying that responsibility, and generally speaking that's not the case with children. Even if a girl takes an abortion, forced or not, it's very unlikely that she ever thought about how such an event could influence her mentally.
 
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