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Monoochrom Sanctuary Suggestions...

Monoochrom

Disciple
Sanctuary legend
Messages
275
Why is it that whenever something like this comes up I feel as if I am trying to be straightforward, yet soft with my criticism, but still come across as a dick?

Look, the main issue with the Design is not the color coordination, which, yes, obviously matters. It's that this is bare bones design, it's the kinda design that you'd expect from a IT-Expert who's clueless about aesthetics. Which is to say it is functional and little more. Which is a bad thing if you actually want to stand out and grow your Site.

Look Arnox, I think the single biggest problem that this Forum has is that you are trying to do everything essentially alone (and that your Goal sounds alot like "become Reddit" which is unrealistic). Yeah, you ask us stuff and make polls. But the issue is more that nobody is stopping you from being sporadic or just doing poorly advised things. Like...this is happening because of the Ama on Reddit, you are being reactionary. I am happy that you try and I'm really not trying to be mean or anything and I also absolutely understand your reservations to handing anyone else the Keys. But I just don't think you are a good All-arounder type of Admin, which is what you are trying to be. There are tons of reasons why a community might not grow, but the main problem is that we don't have a hook at all. We don't really have a Subject Matter, so nothing there to attract, then on YouTube it's mostly gaming related stuff, which then begs the question why this place itself isn't reflective of that. Now arguably one could say that we are about Freedom of Speech or some shit like that...but I personally don't consider that much of a subject matter, even if that can truely be considered to be the case, we pretty obviously at best tolerate Edgelords like InfinityShock and those are the types of people attracted to such sites.

Basically, I think someone needs to sit you down, give you a step by step explanation of how to go about creating a site and then force you to stick to it. Then, when that stuff is done, the person should stick around to keep you from doing silly things like propossing to larger, more active boards with a different community that they should fuse with us and come over here for no apparent reason. Or that doing a AMA for a entirely insignificant Forum could be considered pretty arrogant or naive and therefore a reason to NOT give the Forum a chance, which I guess you didn't consider? Cause, you know, that's what I would have thought from the outside looking in.

See and now I feel like I'm being a Dick again.
 

Arnox

Veteran
Staff member
Founder
Game server maintainer
Messages
3,715
Why is it that whenever something like this comes up I feel as if I am trying to be straightforward, yet soft with my criticism, but still come across as a dick?

Look, the main issue with the Design is not the color coordination, which, yes, obviously matters. It's that this is bare bones design, it's the kinda design that you'd expect from a IT-Expert who's clueless about aesthetics. Which is to say it is functional and little more. Which is a bad thing if you actually want to stand out and grow your Site.

Look Arnox, I think the single biggest problem that this Forum has is that you are trying to do everything essentially alone (and that your Goal sounds alot like "become Reddit" which is unrealistic). Yeah, you ask us stuff and make polls. But the issue is more that nobody is stopping you from being sporadic or just doing poorly advised things. Like...this is happening because of the Ama on Reddit, you are being reactionary. I am happy that you try and I'm really not trying to be mean or anything and I also absolutely understand your reservations to handing anyone else the Keys. But I just don't think you are a good All-arounder type of Admin, which is what you are trying to be. There are tons of reasons why a community might not grow, but the main problem is that we don't have a hook at all. We don't really have a Subject Matter, so nothing there to attract, then on YouTube it's mostly gaming related stuff, which then begs the question why this place itself isn't reflective of that. Now arguably one could say that we are about Freedom of Speech or some shit like that...but I personally don't consider that much of a subject matter, even if that can truely be considered to be the case, we pretty obviously at best tolerate Edgelords like InfinityShock and those are the types of people attracted to such sites.

Basically, I think someone needs to sit you down, give you a step by step explanation of how to go about creating a site and then force you to stick to it. Then, when that stuff is done, the person should stick around to keep you from doing silly things like propossing to larger, more active boards with a different community that they should fuse with us and come over here for no apparent reason. Or that doing a AMA for a entirely insignificant Forum could be considered pretty arrogant or naive and therefore a reason to NOT give the Forum a chance, which I guess you didn't consider? Cause, you know, that's what I would have thought from the outside looking in.

See and now I feel like I'm being a Dick again.
Well FINALLY.

OK so before I say anything at all, I'm gonna move this post to its own thread because there's a lot of ground here I wanna cover and I don't want either one of these topics to cannibalize the other.
 

Arnox

Veteran
Staff member
Founder
Game server maintainer
Messages
3,715
Alright, so to start off with, I'm very happy that you're speaking up here. I don't know if I agree with all this, but do not take that as if I don't want your or other people's suggestions and problems. On Sanctuary v1.0, people just would NOT shut up, but here, I can't really get anyone to speak to me about this stuff without directly asking them, and it's kinda awful...

Addressing your points as I read,

Look, the main issue with the Design is not the color coordination, which, yes, obviously matters. It's that this is bare bones design, it's the kinda design that you'd expect from a IT-Expert who's clueless about aesthetics. Which is to say it is functional and little more. Which is a bad thing if you actually want to stand out and grow your Site.
OK, what's your suggestion(s) for the site design?

I think the single biggest problem that this Forum has is that you are trying to do everything essentially alone (and that your Goal sounds alot like "become Reddit" which is unrealistic).
Because... I am alone really. That's the start of the awfulness of this situation. I don't have much, if any people to ask for help because not many people come here in the first place because nobody signs up because who the hell knows. Can't get help locally either because I value my anonymity. Maybe I am being really paranoid, but in this day and age of no privacy and doxxing on top of everything else, I don't really think so. On top of that, the more cooks in the kitchen, the more diluted the soup. If my partner asks me to compromise the core ideals of this site, I want to be able to say no with no worries of what will happen if they leave the site team. Being the sole person in charge sucks, but at the same time, I know that Sanctuary will always be that. Sanctuary. And to me, that's worth it. Now, HAVING SAID THAT, I'm not at all opposed to people joining the site team now or in the future, but then that brings up the sticky questions of who. Who is proficient enough to actually contribute to the site? Would they even want to, knowing that even I don't get paid a single dime for this site and am, in fact, running it on a pure deficit?

the issue is more that nobody is stopping you from being sporadic or just doing poorly advised things.
You know, you and anyone here can speak up at any time. Any time at all... Yep.

Sorry, I'll dial down the snootiness a bit.

I just don't think you are a good All-arounder type of Admin, which is what you are trying to be.
No need to be sorry. You're absolutely right. I know perfectly well that I'm not the best person for this job at all. But once again, we come to the sticky question of who's gonna help.

There are tons of reasons why a community might not grow, but the main problem is that we don't have a hook at all. We don't really have a Subject Matter, so nothing there to attract, then on YouTube it's mostly gaming related stuff, which then begs the question why this place itself isn't reflective of that.
This is actually my fault. I said we would transition to a gaming focus actually, but it never really happened once I realized the content I would HAVE to put out by myself to make the site even any sort of competitive. Again, I would like to do such content, but I doubt I can keep up with such a strenuous schedule. Especially with college coming up soonish.

to keep you from doing silly things like propossing to larger, more active boards with a different community that they should fuse with us
That was a mistake actually, assuming you're referring to Giraffe forums. I thought they had the same focus as us, but they did not, really. Hence of course why it never happened.

doing a AMA for a entirely insignificant Forum could be considered pretty arrogant or naive and therefore a reason to NOT give the Forum a chance
But, and bear with me here, we aren't JUST a forum. What we offer, a lot of sites simply do not, will not, and will never offer. And that's OK! That's the gap we want to fill (tee-hee), but having said that, communicating that to new visitors seems to be really hard. It seems a lot of people who are against this site seem to just misunderstand entirely what we are and what we wish to do. And those who aren't just see another inactive forum to ignore. "Oh they only have about 5 posts a day. On a good day. Well, guess I'll go back to Reddit then."

But I have NOT given up on this site though and I still have ideas. Don't know if they're any good or not, but I will keep trying.
 
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gaijinkaiju

Disciple
Sanctuary legend
Game server maintainer
Messages
292
This is actually my fault. I said we would transition to a gaming focus actually, but it never really happened once I realized the content I would HAVE to put out by myself to make the site even any sort of competitive. Again, I would like to do such content, but I doubt I can keep up with such a strenuous schedule. Especially with college coming up soonish.
What kind of content were you thinking? I might be able to help you out with that stuff, at-least.
 

Houseman

The Actual Hero
Sanctuary legend
Messages
538
I'll go in for $50 a month to help pay for reddit ads.

Maybe to make payment easier, start a patreon (until they ban us for being nazis). Others can contribute too, that way

Why would people ever come to Sanctuary? I'm a big proponent of the answers: "The people. The discussion". IMO, we need more people here.

I think good discussions will be the "content" that people come here for.
 
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Vendor-Lazarus

Disciple
Sanctuary legend
Messages
461
I've said it before, and I'll say it again. We need to be patient, sadly.
(I'm not thinking Arnox is impatient because more people = more ad money. But wanting to see some growth as a measure of reward for costs)

Since this site is based on Freedom of Speech, what we should focus on to really grow is those being silenced, cast out, banned, and otherwise policed for only speaking their minds.
We should be mentioning this site in context relevant places where such people are likely to congregate.
For now, that means the new anti-establishment and anti-global resistance. The MGTOW's, the RightwingLGBT, the Alt-Right, the Anti-SJW and all manner of people being thought policed and shunned by the current social media platforms. Even Centrists and Leftist get to feel the heavy hand of PC, so this becoming a circle-jerk is hardly likely.
 

andersonnnunes

Disciple
Messages
328
what we should focus on to really grow is those being silenced, cast out, banned, and otherwise policed for only speaking their minds.
Reddit gave birth to both far-right and far-left centered clones for people that felt silenced. Two groups of totally opposed people think Reddit is unfavorable for them. Do these people want to be on the same site? I bet some do, most don't. A site that catered to those who do would be the niche of the niche. Not devoid of value, but hardly going to be full of activity.

(I personally would still visit this place if these two groups were to crash here, but among those being silenced, cast out, banned, and otherwise policed for only speaking their minds I am exceptional [be this good or bad].)
 

Arnox

Veteran
Staff member
Founder
Game server maintainer
Messages
3,715
I'll go in for $50 a month to help pay for reddit ads.

Maybe to make payment easier, start a patreon (until they ban us for being nazis). Others can contribute too, that way

Why would people ever come to Sanctuary? I'm a big proponent of the answers: "The people. The discussion". IMO, we need more people here.

I think good discussions will be the "content" that people come here for.
Well, if Monoochrom is to be believed (and I do think he's kinda right, as stated above) Reddit ads probably won't solve the underlying issue. In any case though, I think it's my responsibility to pay for advertising.

What kind of content were you thinking? I might be able to help you out with that stuff, at-least.
Just gaming content. Or really any content you'd like to do. Just submit it and I'll review it and probably clear it for official content with no holdups. Were you thinking about doing this on a regular schedule? Also remember that we host files now! :D
 

andersonnnunes

Disciple
Messages
328
I think good discussions will be the "content" that people come here for.
Well, if Monoochrom is to be believed (and I do think he's kinda right, as stated above) Reddit ads probably won't solve the underlying issue. In any case though, I think it's my responsibility to pay for advertising.
I read that, for many online groups, less than 5% of users contribute anything and only 1% contribute substantially. The trouble then is: how to attract that 1%?
 

Monoochrom

Disciple
Sanctuary legend
Messages
275
Ok, so Im still without much time. So, for now, I'll just say that I both can and am willing to help. I've admined multiple Forums and Sites of varying size from places like this one to places with several thousand active users (though that one was on easy mode). Which is to say that I at least kinda know what I'm talking about.
 

Arnox

Veteran
Staff member
Founder
Game server maintainer
Messages
3,715
Ok, so Im still without much time. So, for now, I'll just say that I both can and am willing to help. I've admined multiple Forums and Sites of varying size from places like this one to places with several thousand active users (though that one was on easy mode). Which is to say that I at least kinda know what I'm talking about.
It's OK. I'll wait for your much more extensive reply.
 
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